[00:00:00] Liam: Hello and welcome to the very first [00:00:05] episode of the What The Three podcast. This is your beacon through the fog of emerging tech. [00:00:10] I’m one of your co host Liam. I also go by Akiba. And with us [00:00:15] as my co hosts we have Thomas and Charlie, but we’ll get into the full introductions in a [00:00:20] minute. What we’re going to do is we’re going to guide you through the exhilarating yet intricate journey of [00:00:25] being an emerging tech founder.
[00:00:27] Liam: Basically, Charlie. [00:00:30] I think you’re the best person to explain it in the kind of elevator pitch as to what this podcast [00:00:35] is because it ultimately was your original baby, um, in terms of [00:00:40] seeing that there just wasn’t anything out there for emerging tech founders, [00:00:45] like where do you start? That’s the goal of what we’re trying to achieve here, isn’t it?
[00:00:49] Charlie: [00:00:50] Yeah, I, oh, thanks for that awesome intro. The direction [00:00:55] of travel for this was always been, there’s so much content out there [00:01:00] and we actually did a breakdown of the market and we did research and looked at, well [00:01:05] there’s entrepreneur podcasts, there’s web3 podcasts, there’s AI podcasts, there’s investment podcasts, [00:01:10] but actually when you look at the intersection and you watch a lot of this content, which [00:01:15] I have been for years, there’s nothing in there that’s a practical step by [00:01:20] step version of what are you doing?
[00:01:22] Charlie: You know, what do you do, right? Like, [00:01:25] what is it that I’m supposed to do?, Well, you’ve really got to know your numbers. The, [00:01:30] the sort of general frameworks that these experts come on these podcasts and, you know, [00:01:35] they’re useful and they’re, I think it’s because it’s obvious to them, right?
[00:01:39] Charlie: Like, it’s [00:01:40] obvious to them, yeah, you’ve got to know your numbers. What’s that actually mean? Well, you’ve got to have balance [00:01:45] sheet, you’ve got to communicate with your, your FD, you’ve got to, What’s the most important number? [00:01:50] Is it lifetime value? Is it, you know, acquisition cost? Like, where exactly am I [00:01:55] going with this information?
[00:01:57] Charlie: And whilst these people are really [00:02:00] knowledgeable, I think that’s the actual problem. They know this stuff. And [00:02:05] what might be a flash of the blindingly obvious to them, is something that we actually [00:02:10] have to take a course on to A. Figure out what it is they mean and B. [00:02:15] What we practically have to do as startup founders to say, okay, like [00:02:20] This is the next task that I have to achieve [00:02:25] this salient sort of number of activity that that [00:02:30] actually is is creating value for my business.
[00:02:33] Liam: That all sounds great but [00:02:35] everyone watching now is saying awesome. That sounds great, but why the hell should I [00:02:40] listen to you three nerds? So, let’s explain why you should [00:02:45] listen to us. I’ll go first. So I started my career. I [00:02:50] mean, I’m an elder millennial. I used this term on X today because I realized I’m an elder millennial.[00:02:55]
[00:02:55] Liam: 20 years ago, getting into, I started as a [00:03:00] filmmaker and I made a feature film while I was at university, became an entrepreneur [00:03:05] at university, started my own business, and then that grew and grew and grew until the [00:03:10] point where I had my own media company. We started winning awards. We had clients like Suzuki.
[00:03:14] Liam: We [00:03:15] had Nike, we did stuff with Umbro, Vimto, Colgate, [00:03:20] huge blue chip brands and given that I have always been a nerd and you [00:03:25] know a geek at heart. We kind of diversified from just doing video production to doing web design, doing [00:03:30] software, to doing marketing. We’re over a full service marketing agency. And it was about that [00:03:35] time around 2016 when I realized I absolutely hated [00:03:40] marketing.
[00:03:41] Liam: It wasn’t for me. And this is something that I’ve realized in terms of this [00:03:45] entrepreneurs journey. We’re going to be talking about this throughout the series is that [00:03:50] Elder Millennials, Gen Z, Gen Alpha, we’re still [00:03:55] taught this idea that you go to school, get good grades, get a job, [00:04:00] get a house.
[00:04:00] Liam: Like that doesn’t happen. That coinbase advert I absolutely love it. It resonates so [00:04:05] much to me because it’s just not true. You go through phases and [00:04:10] different things in your life. I don’t know anyone that has left university or left school, [00:04:15] from my generation, and had one job or even actually had one career.
[00:04:19] Liam: [00:04:20] Everyone has multiple careers. So I realized around 2016 that whilst I was good at marketing, I’d kind of [00:04:25] fallen into it. It wasn’t for me. And that’s when I started working with Charlie… doing [00:04:30] more marketing still. But instead of working directly with [00:04:35] clients as much, it was more consulting, it was more on the strategy. I realized that strategy was [00:04:40] something that I fitted better into. I think one of our, [00:04:45] very good friends Ross McKenzie helped me realize that my skill is [00:04:50] figuring out the puzzle before others have realized where the pieces are [00:04:55] and that is something that’s very intangible.
[00:04:57] Liam: I have a lot of intangibles, right? I think that’s a lot of [00:05:00] millennials in general have a lot of intangibles. They have different, like we used to talk about like M shape and [00:05:05] T shaped people. I think we’ve got a lot of like zigzag people in our generation. [00:05:10] But then when 2022 happened, sorry [00:05:15] 2020 happened, everyone managed to take stock, I got back into [00:05:20] blockchain. There’s something that I’d been doing with my media company in 2014. We’d been mining Dogecoin [00:05:25] with the video editing suites, basically when everyone finished work, instead of [00:05:30] turning off the computers, they would switch on the Dogecoin miner and we’d mine overnight.
[00:05:34] Liam: I’m [00:05:35] sure we’ll have some anecdotes about why I am not a Dogecoin millionaire right now, even [00:05:40] though I was mining Doge in 2014 when the price was, I think at the moment it’s like [00:05:45] five cents, back then there was like six or seven zeros before the five. That’s [00:05:50] how early I was in Doge. And I started [00:05:55] writing again, which was my original first love.
[00:05:56] Liam: I wrote the feature film that I made at university and through writing, [00:06:00] I’ve found my way back into blockchain. I’m now the senior editor at [00:06:05] Cryptoslate, where I make content. I’m the co host of the SlateCast with Nate. [00:06:10] I’m also a contributor for Forbes. So I write the digital assets [00:06:15] section for Forbes.
[00:06:16] Liam: I’ve been all over the world speaking and working and [00:06:20] collaborating with crypto projects. I’m also an advisor with [00:06:25] Core blockchain that I think we’re going to be talking with later on in the season, which is something I’m very excited about. It’s a very [00:06:30] cool project and it shows the difference in emerging tech and what blockchain [00:06:35] can do.
[00:06:35] Liam: Ultimately that’s why maybe you should listen to me. I’ve done some interesting [00:06:40] things. I’ve worked with some interesting people but probably the most powerful thing for me right now [00:06:45] is the fact that i’m in the middle of all the conversations and that’s why I’m so happy with [00:06:50] what I’m doing in a career right now.
[00:06:51] Liam: I’m getting text messages from [00:06:55] founders of huge projects asking if they can come on the SlateCast to talk. We’ve got Sonny from [00:07:00] Osmosis coming on like next week, which I’m really excited, I always spoke to him previously. I’m going to [00:07:05] be meeting up with Paolo Ardino in Prague later on this year to talk.
[00:07:09] Liam: He’s the Tether [00:07:10] CEO. Like all these people are just within my black book and like, [00:07:15] I’m not a celebrity. I’m not famous. But i’m talking to a lot of people that I think are very cool and are very [00:07:20] well known. So whilst maybe don’t, maybe listen to me, maybe I have [00:07:25] some good ideas every now and then but what I do have is ability to listen and learn from some very intelligent people [00:07:30] around me and hopefully kind of regurgitate that [00:07:35] into some of these episodes and some of the thinking that we are going to be doing.
[00:07:39] Liam: So [00:07:40] that’s me, why maybe you should probably not but maybe listen to me. Let’s [00:07:45] now introduce… oh, so very good host I am. So I am Liam Wright [00:07:50] but I do go by Akiba and as I say senior editor at Cryptoslate and contributor for Forbes. [00:07:55] Thomas, let’s move over to you, Sir.
[00:07:58] Thomas: I, I really want to ask a question [00:08:00] first before we get started.
[00:08:01] Thomas: Can we, can we watch your feature film anywhere? Is it still somewhere online?
[00:08:04] Liam: So it’s [00:08:05] called, it’s called ExCathedra, E X C A T H [00:08:10] E D R A, ExCathedra and yeah, it’s available to buy and rent [00:08:15] on Amazon.
[00:08:16] Thomas: There we go. I, I like it.
[00:08:17] Liam: You search a ExCathedra movie or search from my name [00:08:20] and it should come up. It’s on IMDB, you can find it through that as well.
[00:08:23] Thomas: Sweet. [00:08:25] You say you’re not a celebrity, but you know, you’re a little bit of a celebrity.
[00:08:28] Liam: I was, [00:08:30] I peaked in 2009. I managed to do this the [00:08:35] other night. If you go on Google trends, I put it on Twitter, on Google Trends, you know, [00:08:40] it is all relative, isn’t it?
[00:08:41] Liam: It’s a hundred to zero. So in like 2008 or [00:08:45] 2007, I was a hundred… and now I’m a zero.[00:08:50]
[00:08:50] Thomas: I, I, I think that in and of itself has been a very interesting per experience, as [00:08:55] well, right? Like at least that’s how I look at these things.
[00:08:58] Liam: I got [00:09:00] de-platformed from Wikipedia because I’m no longer relevant now. Quick [00:09:05] plug, IQ.Wiki, the Web3 [00:09:10] version of Wikipedia.
[00:09:11] Liam: Navin that builds that project is very, very cool. [00:09:15] Decentralize everything.
[00:09:18] Thomas: You’re not de-platformed there [00:09:20] because you can’t. That is definitely a story I want to hear later on, [00:09:25] Liam, about how you got de-platformed from Wikipedia. Because I think that’s, [00:09:30] stories for days.
[00:09:31] Liam: We’ll talk about it.
[00:09:34] Liam: So [00:09:35] quickly, quick plug again for us though this time, we will also be running what we’re going to be calling What The [00:09:40] Three After Dark, which will be us three, completely unscripted, Just [00:09:45] waffling about Web3 and emerging tech, and it will be a lot of fun. A lot [00:09:50] more laid back, a lot more chill, a lot more talking over each other, but, I will [00:09:55] recommend that as the, the live, we’re going to be doing that hopefully live on X [00:10:00] spaces.
[00:10:00] Thomas: Absolutely. Yeah, so from my perspective, [00:10:05] I started my career in healthcare. Absolutely non tech. So what you just [00:10:10] said, Liam resonates very heavily with me. Multiple careers, right? Like, I don’t believe at the [00:10:15] time being coming from the Netherlands, coming from a small bubble, you take one career, you keep on [00:10:20] doing that.
[00:10:20] Thomas: So my friends, consultants and social counselors, and [00:10:25] I figured I should do the same. So I did eight years of healthcare [00:10:30] with, very interesting stories that some of them, Some point maybe I’ll, I’ll refer [00:10:35] to. I was telling Charlie a couple this week. Um, and [00:10:40] after that, I realized this is, well, I like healthcare and I’m all like social [00:10:45] healthcare.
[00:10:45] Thomas: And then while I like my patients and they were, “batshit” crazy in the most positive [00:10:50] sense. We hit a point or I hit a point where I thought, [00:10:55] I’m not sure if I really wanted to do this for the rest of my life around like 2014, [00:11:00] 2013, I was 23/24, I’m not sure if I want to do this. And then we had [00:11:05] an interesting thing going on in, in the organization that I worked at and they said… “hey, [00:11:10] look, we’re building this, digital call center for, our patients.”
[00:11:14] Thomas: Our patients are [00:11:15] generally, you know, average, IQ and they needed help, nothing [00:11:20] like that in the Netherlands. So I helped building that in that year. And I was always, [00:11:25] as you, Liam, always a nerd, always like at home, like taking apart [00:11:30] computers and building servers and I do all the crazy shit never really got into [00:11:35] blockchain up until that point I mean, I dabbled a little bit but nothing from the technology perspective [00:11:40] And I decided after years like you know what screw this I’m gonna do something else.
[00:11:44] Thomas: I want to [00:11:45] really do something that I love. I think it’s technology. So I started literally [00:11:50] again as a consultant like, I think everybody that started in I.T. who doesn’t know how to program starts as a [00:11:55] consultant and I have very strong opinions about, like, these kind of jobs because I’ve [00:12:00] been through it myself.
[00:12:01] Thomas: But I learned a lot and I got a really interesting perspective [00:12:05] on, commercial technology because I’ve been always doing, like, just private crappy [00:12:10] technology stuff on my own, writing crappy Python scripts that worked, but nobody would ever be [00:12:15] proud of. And from there on, I just dove deeper and deeper.
[00:12:19] Thomas: [00:12:20] I, I moved countries, came into a different country, started in the outsourcing agencies, [00:12:25] world here in Poland, which was a wild experience. [00:12:30] And I think if we have Polish viewers, they will maybe laugh or they’ll [00:12:35] scratch their ears like, why was it wild? If you’re working with Polish agencies working for [00:12:40] Unicorns in San Francisco, the culture difference or culture [00:12:45] shock is sometimes pretty big. Talking proactive versus passive [00:12:50] communication, clients that will call you in the middle of the night getting stuff done. [00:12:55] Really, really wild experience, maybe also because we worked with a Unicorn, still really [00:13:00] enjoyed it.
[00:13:00] Thomas: As a project manager, I was always, I brought all the crazy stuff and all the interesting [00:13:05] things I learned about communication and technology to the job, up until we [00:13:10] got contracted for an L0, building an L0 and they were like, “hey, Thomas, you know, got this team. [00:13:15] You wanna have this and built this research [00:13:20] paper into a functionable L one or L zero.”
[00:13:25] Thomas: [00:13:25] That was my first real work in crypto and it was insane, [00:13:30] we’re talking 2017 ish, like I would [00:13:35] say middle 2017. So Web3 wasn’t a thing, right? It was just blockchain. It was, we had. [00:13:40] a bunch of nerds doing, writing code and having some ideas about [00:13:45] how commercial blockchain looks like.
[00:13:46] Thomas: These guys were part of that and they pulled in some, some commercial [00:13:50] looking guys. It was an insane time, like nobody really knew how this tech works. Super [00:13:55] bleeding edge, you know, crazy hours, again, time zone differences, [00:14:00] but I fell in love. I, I just, I couldn’t stop looking at the tech, like [00:14:05] exploring it.
[00:14:05] Thomas: We, we wrote this particular L0 in Scala, and I was [00:14:10] always a big fan of Scala, from my work with, with my engineers that, [00:14:15] that I’ve been working prior. And I just fell in love. I found it such a [00:14:20] beautiful, crazy thing to think about, but like, wait, we’re doing something that’s completely outside [00:14:25] of a system we’re going to, in this case with data security, are we going to build something that is not, not on [00:14:30] any system?
[00:14:30] Thomas: Yes, we’re going to do that. That’s insane. Tell me more. And that’s where I get [00:14:35] started. And then we got contracted for another job and another job. And we did integrations and we built wallets and [00:14:40] we did early DeFi pieces. And I got deeper and deeper and [00:14:45] deeper and deeper and up until the point that I was like I think I need to make a career out of this. [00:14:50] Like not because I want to make money out of it, I just really really love what [00:14:55] i’m doing.
[00:14:55] Thomas: I love talking to all these founders. I love talking to all these engineers. I love hearing these crazy ideas [00:15:00] and seeing what we can and cannot do. So, you know, I joined a firm a couple years [00:15:05] ago, also in 2020, and it was already what I did, like was really heavily involved in [00:15:10] building for three years from 2017 2020. Joined the firm [00:15:15] in 2020, we did a lot of BizDev, which was great.[00:15:20]
[00:15:20] Thomas: And as you said, Liam, like, you know, sitting with all these people, I’m not a celebrity at all. I [00:15:25] don’t have, I think, the black book that any of you have but somehow people [00:15:30] that had something to say always found me. And also founders that had something to say or something to build always found me, and [00:15:35] we did.
[00:15:35] Thomas: A couple of really crazy, interesting projects, and also a lot of research. [00:15:40] And that kind of went forward into my newest company or consultancy actually, which is [00:15:45] INTERS3CT, which I’m co founder of, where we really focus on blockchain [00:15:50] and AI and actually the impact of what that has on commercial solutions.
[00:15:54] Thomas: Like I’m a big [00:15:55] believer of adoption. And I truly believe that adoption doesn’t [00:16:00] come, uh, by talking about the technology, but talking about the solutions that this [00:16:05] technology can provide. Having these discussions done for the [00:16:10] last couple of years, it just made me more and more passionate.
[00:16:12] Thomas: I was like, I want to do this full time [00:16:15] with my own company and running this. And the interesting part of all of this, what I found half a year [00:16:20] ago in the bear, probably for most people that are in crypto, I was like, no, crypto is dead, it’ll never come [00:16:25] back. Then AI hit really hard. Like Jenny, I had really hard time.
[00:16:28] Thomas: It’s like, Oh, crypto is [00:16:30] super dead. Nothing will happen. And I said, well, okay, even [00:16:35] if the crypto side of things doesn’t go off, which I find a hard time believing. I [00:16:40] just love the technology. I love the vibe and the passion of the founders. I love the degenerate [00:16:45] memes in the bear market. I love the degenerate memes in the bull, right?
[00:16:49] Thomas: Like that’s [00:16:50] why I’m here for it. I’m here to have a enjoyable life and while I’m [00:16:55] working. And By doing that, I just made so much friends and so much people that [00:17:00] I learn from every day and our motto in that is, my [00:17:05] personal motto is always like, Why do you need a blockchain? I have a group with my research team on Telegram, [00:17:10] which is literally called that.
[00:17:10] Thomas: Why do you need a blockchain? Every time I ask people that, they shill things to me, [00:17:15] Why do you need a blockchain? And for that same thing, I say the same about AI. Why do you need AI? Why do you need Gen [00:17:20] AI? If you can’t really answer that question, You’re probably just trying to lift all the hype, [00:17:25] which is fine but we’re trying to build something that is impactful, trying to help founders moving that [00:17:30] forward. So I could talk about this for hours because I’m just very passionate, but you know, I want to give. Charlie, [00:17:35] some speaker time as well otherwise he just sits there.
[00:17:38] Liam: So we’ll get [00:17:40] onto Charlie, as you can maybe start to see, this was Charlie’s vision that you had the [00:17:45] marketer to turned kind of, well, not influencer, but I’m within [00:17:50] the influence sphere of the space, which is very much communications and [00:17:55] media.
[00:17:55] Liam: So the media side of things, you’ve got Thomas, which is very much the hacker, the tech side of things. [00:18:00] And then we come on to Charlie who is?
[00:18:04] Charlie: [00:18:05] Well, of that trifecta, the hustler side of things, that would be [00:18:10] more the finance, more the, the sales, put together the pitch deck [00:18:15] and have the chat kind of guy. At least that’s, that’s what, the [00:18:20] standard central casting for a startup team usually is.
[00:18:24] Charlie: [00:18:25] I’m wondering to myself, like, how do I follow up your, your two [00:18:30] introductions? They’re both pretty good. It’s just like, Hmm. [00:18:35] Okay. I started [00:18:40] my career for my sins in, in PR. So [00:18:45] we were working in, in Milan and it was one [00:18:50] of those, one of those moments where you can’t afford university.
[00:18:53] Charlie: This was during sort of [00:18:55] I class myself as an elder millennial as well, I guess. And I had to pay for school. [00:19:00] So, entrepreneurship for me has always been something out of necessity. [00:19:05] In Milan, there’s two organizations that run [00:19:10] nightlife there. So we essentially organized events for, the [00:19:15] international students in that city.
[00:19:16] Charlie: And because we were international, we were allowed to work with both of those [00:19:20] organizations. And that’s really where my sort of first sales experience came from, which [00:19:25] was come to the party, in essence. And, from [00:19:30] there, having sort of bombed out of university, [00:19:35] I then did a bunch of manual jobs. So, I was [00:19:40] literally, my job was putting paper in envelopes for a legal firm.[00:19:45]
[00:19:45] Charlie: And at some point I was like, okay king of menial jobs. [00:19:50] So there’s probably more to life than this So I kind of set myself up a bit of a penance for [00:19:55] bombing out of uni and, said I will pick and stack [00:20:00] a thousand boxes at Amazon FC fulfillment center in Milton Keynes, which is not far from where [00:20:05] I am now.
[00:20:06] Charlie: I did that during the time that [00:20:10] Amazon was in the papers here in the UK for being, for not treating their [00:20:15] staff well, I guess is the easiest way to put that and I did that during the Christmas [00:20:20] rush at night. And I don’t know if anyone’s ever done some factory work, but [00:20:25] it’s a pretty brutal gig.
[00:20:26] Charlie: You’re, you’re getting up and in work, you’re getting up at 5 p.m. , [00:20:30] in work for God knows when finishing at 6 a. m. Picking and packing and [00:20:35] stacking boxes. As soon as I, I sort of hit, [00:20:40] I had this counter in my head by this is like box 237, this is box 500, this [00:20:45] is box 700. I’d sort of had enough and got [00:20:50] to, when I got to a thousand, I was like, right.
[00:20:52] Charlie: I firmly believe there’s more for life [00:20:55] than this. Picked myself up, started studying hard, [00:21:00] went back to university and started applying to master’s courses. Luckily [00:21:05] I got accepted into Cranfield again, just down the road from where I am, North London [00:21:10] and that experience sort of shot my [00:21:15] trajectory into the finance world, which is where at that time everyone was making lots of money and it [00:21:20] sounded like a great idea.
[00:21:22] Charlie: I became a cost [00:21:25] leadership consultant for private equity companies that were being [00:21:30] bought, sold, or economized. And I got an introduction into how it was to be a sort of [00:21:35] corporate attack dog. It’s what I’ve heard one of my directors describe us as, [00:21:40] where we come in after a purchase or for a buy, or just when a company [00:21:45] needs to find some extra cash and economize their balance sheet or whatever they [00:21:50] were buying actually a really skilled, highly technical job.
[00:21:55] Charlie: [00:21:55] That taught me a lot about work [00:22:00] ethic, taught me a lot about how you negotiate and have conversations with people. And [00:22:05] in consulting, it’s, it’s kind of a, like the entire career is a trial by fire [00:22:10] and you are 27 and you’re briefing a C suite team on [00:22:15] the direction of, you know, interestingly, like the specific thing that you know a lot [00:22:20] about, whether it be their budget for travel to, you know, the [00:22:25] specific kind of grain that they’re putting in their cookie and you have to learn that [00:22:30] stuff immediately.
[00:22:32] Charlie: Welcome to your job. You’ve just traveled an hour to get to this [00:22:35] random office that is at the ass end of God knows where, and now you have [00:22:40] to learn all of this kind of stuff and make the numbers work. I think I, [00:22:45] I lasted in that gig to Liam’s point, maybe 15 to 18 [00:22:50] months, year, year and a half, where I looked around and I was like, this isn’t the kind of where I [00:22:55] want to go.
[00:22:58] You know, that was the [00:23:00] experience I was having at the time as well. I was probably not the easiest employee, no [00:23:05] doubt. I went from that company to another company called Cadence and it was [00:23:10] basically sharp end of the corporate spear straight down to public sector. So I was working, [00:23:15] my first project was again, consulting, but, uh, technical consulting, so [00:23:20] I was working for the department for education and, credit to the team, there [00:23:25] was a project, the first project I was put on was called SFB [00:23:30] and it was the, it’s the [00:23:35] piece of tech that all educational institutions in the UK report their numbers into, [00:23:40] and thankfully the team did an amazing job and really what they needed from me was kind [00:23:45] of, understand the project, understand what they were doing and provide [00:23:50] them that top cover, like help in essence, help my director support my directors [00:23:55] at the time to navigate that political landscape and essentially give [00:24:00] the team a bit of a shove when they needed it to ensure that they pass beta that [00:24:05] team went on to launch that project and I think they won awards and [00:24:10] it was actually lauded in the house of lords. One of their biggest wins in the last decade, which is [00:24:15] fantastic. After that I went on [00:24:20] to a project called DDAT, which was essentially building the technical infrastructure.
[00:24:24] Charlie: [00:24:25] And at that point I was then tapped up by the CEO of that [00:24:30] consultancy. I mean, so we’re going to go work in this new cool thing called blockchain. [00:24:35] To which my response was probably along the lines of… that sounds cool. What is [00:24:40] it? It took me on a wild ride. I [00:24:45] worked in two companies at the same time, one called Block Labs, another called [00:24:50] Circular.
[00:24:51] Charlie: It was one of those sort [00:24:55] of pivotal moments in your career where [00:25:00] you’re like, Hey, I’ve kind of, I’ve grown a bit here. Like I’m sitting at a table. [00:25:05] Couldn’t quote me on this, but we were in a WeWork in the West End of London [00:25:10] and, we were all sort of talking about what we could do for these companies, [00:25:15] like what was our skillset.
[00:25:18] The [00:25:20] CEO tagged me up and said, I’ll be the CEO. He brought his, [00:25:25] COO with him, so he’ll be like, I’ll be Chief Operations Officer. There was a hedge [00:25:30] fund guy being like, Hey, I’ll do, I’ll do Chief Finance. There was, another chap [00:25:35] who, who was essentially cyber warfare hacker like Thomas, who basically wrote…
[00:25:39] Thomas: Whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, [00:25:40] whoa.
[00:25:40] Thomas: I, I wanna… I am not even close to guys like that. I . I don’t have those [00:25:45] kind of skills. Charlie .
[00:25:48] Charlie: You know, he basically wrote the rule book for [00:25:50] GCHQ on cyber warfare and, um, he was like, I’ll be the CTO. There’s no argument [00:25:55] there. He got around the table, got around to me and I was like, [00:26:00] all right, I’ll do the marketing because everything else had been taken and I was probably the only one [00:26:05] who had an Instagram account. So it’s funny that [00:26:10] you talk about your career trajectory, you kind of fall into these things. From [00:26:15] that came, the collaboration, with [00:26:20] Liam, so after a while, I left those businesses to, [00:26:25] start my own entrepreneurial journey in doing that.
[00:26:28] Charlie: Liam and I collaborated on an [00:26:30] AI application. And from that, we’ve then [00:26:35] got to ASP3CT where we’re essentially helping businesses build their own [00:26:40] businesses using marketing, operational efficiency and strategic advisory. So [00:26:45] it’s never just a clean road, [00:26:50] right?
[00:26:50] Thomas: No, it isn’t. And I think that, to that point, [00:26:55] like sometimes when I hear you guys talking, I’m, I, I almost have imposter syndrome.
[00:26:59] Thomas: [00:27:00] I’m like, I mean, there’s so much knowledge to get in the world, and there’s [00:27:05] so much knowledge I don’t possess. I see this every day when I’m outside my comfort zone. I [00:27:10] would say tech and being outside my comfort zone, tech is okay, but when I talk marketing, when I talk [00:27:15] anything that is not tech,
[00:27:17] Thomas: I’m always like, shit, there’s so much learning. And I hear you guys start [00:27:20] making a career out of these things. You can’t know everything, but it’s always that imposter [00:27:25] syndrome because as an entrepreneur, you’re supposed to know something of it, at least.
[00:27:30] [00:27:30]
[00:27:30] Liam: I disagree with that. I mean, there’s something that I, I based the first kind of, I think 10, [00:27:35] 15 years of my career on the concept that if I didn’t feel [00:27:40] I was out of my depth, I knew that I wasn’t moving forward.
[00:27:43] Liam: Like, whenever you [00:27:45] feel comfortable, whenever you feel like I know how to do this, that’s fine, if that’s [00:27:50] where you want to be in your career, but that means you’re not moving forward. The times when you’re moving forward in [00:27:55] your career is when you feel like you’re an imposter. For me, that is the definition of an entrepreneur or [00:28:00] the entrepreneurial spirit.
[00:28:02] Liam: But the thing is, and this is why I wanted to bring this up, like, [00:28:05] so I loved Charlie’s idea of bringing us three together to talk about this for a [00:28:10] podcast, because his concept was, where do you start? And for [00:28:15] me, I had exactly that problem in a lot of parts of my career in marketing, but [00:28:20] especially one thing that really jumps to mind is in film.
[00:28:23] Liam: And what there was [00:28:25] in the early 2000s is that I’ve got it on one of these shelves behind me somewhere, a big [00:28:30] green fat book called the Guerrilla Filmmakers Handbook, [00:28:35] right? And that was a book that everyone who got into filmmaking, basically, [00:28:40] that is the reason why YouTube, kind of, almost, exists in a way because that was a [00:28:45] tool that basically gave you all the hacks to get started in filming, but also gave you [00:28:50] all the blurb, all the terminology.
[00:28:51] Liam: What’s a best boy? What’s a gaffer? The stuff that [00:28:55] you don’t know where to start. Now we have AI that we can ask these questions, but [00:29:00] like the thing is what you don’t have… So, one of the things we’re gonna be doing is [00:29:05] I have actually been building a What The 3 GPT for listeners to be able to access [00:29:10] and use that will be being built into the show, which is a bit of a [00:29:15] exclusive kind of behind the scenes idea of what we’re going to be releasing to [00:29:20] subscribers.
[00:29:20] Liam: It’s going to be completely free. The only thing we’re going to do, well, I say that, we’re going to charge you your information [00:29:25] because that is what free really means. The thing that I wanted to then [00:29:30] come back to with that is that with the idea and having that place, if we want to be the Guerilla Filmmakers [00:29:35] Handbook, but for emerging tech founders is we’re also just three [00:29:40] guys that are doing it.
[00:29:41] Liam: And what we’re going to be is no bullshit, no, no overhype, [00:29:45] because the thing is, if you haven’t figured it out yet, 99 percent of [00:29:50] influencers, don’t know what they’re talking about either, and it’s all bravado and [00:29:55] front and image. And I’m going to show you this because it makes me look [00:30:00] good. They don’t show you the other stuff.
[00:30:02] Liam: We’ll show you everything warts and all. We’re three guys that [00:30:05] have had, I’d say in terms of the global population, extremely [00:30:10] successful careers. I think there’s a lot of people that, without sounding [00:30:15] like an asshole, there’s a lot of people that would be happy to have had similar careers to [00:30:20] us, but we’re not the 1 percent of like, we’re not the Gary [00:30:25] V’s. Well, I think that’s kind of for me that resonates more [00:30:30] because only 1 percent can be.
[00:30:33] Thomas: I agree and [00:30:35] I and that’s also I think what I mean by imposter syndrome. I don’t like there’s this you can look at it two ways, [00:30:40] right?
[00:30:40] Thomas: Like I fully agree I think the moment you get it, but when I get a imposter syndrome is when I talk to [00:30:45] I know my lawyers about something and I’m like, I am really out of my depth. Okay, let’s learn [00:30:50] this, you know, and this happens way more often than I want to [00:30:55] admit also to myself, I’m like, shouldn’t I know this kind of thing?
[00:30:58] Thomas: But that’s [00:31:00] also the other side of it. It’s like, Oh, I don’t know this. So [00:31:05] let’s learn about this. And that’s what I mean by the imposter syndrome. And I think that a lot of tech people that [00:31:10] start building a company or start their entrepreneurial journey have that thing, because they’re [00:31:15] like most, most tech entrepreneurs I know they’re stellar, right? Like they’re [00:31:20] you ask them anything about their piece of technology. They will go on for days [00:31:25] and they will explain it to you in such detail. But then you ask them what the revenue structure is. And they look at your, like. [00:31:30] Revenue structure. I have no idea what that means.
[00:31:33] Thomas: Right. And, and that [00:31:35] imposter syndrome, I think it’s a really good call to action. And that’s always what I’m, if you don’t know, hire [00:31:40] for it. Learn or hire for it. And in this case, I [00:31:45] generally hire for it because I just don’t have, the skills of that of a lawyer. [00:31:50] But to that point, I think it’s a really strong call to action [00:31:55] on both sides hire or learn it.
[00:31:57] Thomas: So yeah, but depending on how you look at it, [00:32:00] right?
[00:32:01] Charlie: I know then I agree. I mean to take the the [00:32:05] concept forward um, the the biggest issue [00:32:10] i’ve i’ve always had and I consume a lot of content is [00:32:15] When, when you look at the, like the episodic nature of a lot of these [00:32:20] podcasters, it’s very much like what’s happening at the time and what’s relevant to [00:32:25] your situation.
[00:32:28] Charlie: And, you know, it can be very, very [00:32:30] specific, can be sector specific, and you’ve got to kind of strike this balance between [00:32:35] filling the void and trying to be as specific as possible. [00:32:40] And when I was sort of. Brainstorming that how do we, how does like, what’s three filled, [00:32:45] fill that void. Like to Liam’s point, when we’re saying, right, we’re going to go [00:32:50] out, we’re going to like speak to all these, the ex, the experts, our only real need [00:32:55] for quantification in this is that we’re qualified enough to ask the [00:33:00] questions that matter.
[00:33:00] Charlie: So one, one of the biggest pieces for us is [00:33:05] like, okay, we’ve gone out and we’ve said, okay, like we [00:33:10] want to. First thing we want to do is add value because if you don’t [00:33:15] add value in a, in a podcast or any form of media, why should anyone bother spending their time watching your stuff? [00:33:20] Number one. Um, number two is we obviously [00:33:25] want to make sure that what we’re talking about isn’t bollocks because [00:33:30] we’ve got our faces on it.
[00:33:32] Charlie: That’s quite a big deal. That’s fair. [00:33:35] Uh, and, and third is, um, how do we make this content [00:33:40] as evergreen as possible, which is where the framework key balance comes into [00:33:45] play, where people are saying, okay, I’m screwed. Sort of give you the general pieces, because the general pieces give you the [00:33:50] access to the thinking, that the thinking is something you can then go and research.
[00:33:53] Charlie: So it gives you like [00:33:55] the the white stripe around the football pitch That shows you [00:34:00] okay. You’re playing in this field and then you know where the goals are so [00:34:05] really the the lack of comprehensive guides to this kind of stuff is is where [00:34:10] We think that this has got an edge and where we’re really looking on [00:34:15] Adding that value and taking it forward and it’s
[00:34:17] Liam: why I think people should follow and [00:34:20] watch our stuff I think you raised some really great points there charlie in that which I kind of missed [00:34:25] missed really which is You We’re also in this as well.
[00:34:29] Liam: We’re on the [00:34:30] journey with everyone that is watching that we’re basically saying, Hey, like, we’re going to go [00:34:35] do it. So you guys don’t have to. And we’ve got the contact. So we’re going to bring the people in that know this [00:34:40] stuff. And one of the things that I’m sure you like always sort of agree with is kind of, you know, [00:34:45] Verifying your thesis.
[00:34:46] Liam: So we’ve got a thesis as to this is what the structure is for the emerging tech [00:34:50] business. But we’re going to verify that by speaking to the experts and verify and they can like [00:34:55] someone might come on the show and go, Hey, why are you doing this as number three? This should be number two. This should be number [00:35:00] 10, but you’ve got this all wrong and school us on some stuff.
[00:35:03] Liam: And that would be excited to be a part [00:35:05] of that conversation if, and when that happens. Um, So [00:35:10] yeah, I’m I’m very much excited. I think you’re completely right in terms of having that playbook. [00:35:15] And that again is something that I’m going to keep. I’m going to keep shilling What The Three GPT [00:35:20] because it’s going to be my baby.
[00:35:21] Liam: Um, we’re going to be putting all of the [00:35:25] information from each episode into this and training it on the data. So [00:35:30] essentially what you’ll actually have is an AI generative AI [00:35:35] tool. The where Charlie says, Oh, you’ve got the framework. Okay. Well, imagine then from that [00:35:40] podcast where someone’s talking to you and giving you the framework, you can then actually have a one to one conversation [00:35:45] with him.
[00:35:45] Liam: Like the Q and a, after a podcast that sometimes you might get, well, you’re going to have basically access to [00:35:50] that through a GPT four powered AI tool [00:35:55] that you’ll be able to jump onto our website and access at any time and put in, like, [00:36:00] we’ve gone through, if we’ve just gone through a, like a legal section, you’re going to be able to go in there and ask it for, [00:36:05] like, Advice on not legal advice that you’ll be able to take action on.
[00:36:09] Liam: But I mean, [00:36:10] get some ideas of who you should be talking to those things, where there’s stuff where you don’t know what you don’t [00:36:15] know. Well, if the expert knows it, this GPT tool will be able to help you. And once we get into [00:36:20] things like content and marketing, then it a hundred percent is going to be to help you figure out content plans and marketing and [00:36:25] stuff.
[00:36:25] Liam: So yeah, basically if you watch one of our episodes and you think, Ooh, That was [00:36:30] really great. The content that the guest spoke about was amazing. Wait a few hours and jump on the [00:36:35] GPT and you can essentially talk to a virtual version of them. But it’s also a version of [00:36:40] every other guest as well put into one mammoth epic AI tool.
[00:36:44] Liam: Can you [00:36:45] tell I’m a bit excited about it? Ah, chill. [00:36:50]
[00:36:50] Thomas: Oh man, but I think that that is, when we talk about podcasts, like so I, [00:36:55] Charlie, you’re, you’re an addict when it comes to podcasts. Um, in, in the [00:37:00] best way possible, right? Like you’re, you’re consuming 10 times, 20 times more content than I do, [00:37:05] but I always found really hard with podcasts and it’s like, it’s a lot of listening.
[00:37:09] Thomas: And I, I like [00:37:10] interactive podcast. I like interactive. And that’s why this resonates [00:37:15] very well with me, Liam, because when I hear something interesting, I don’t want to [00:37:20] go to Google because I generally, when I have a podcast on, I’m doing something. [00:37:25] What is nice with this GPT, and I assume it’s available if I have [00:37:30] GPT 4, I can, I’m not sure how it will be available, but I assume it will be [00:37:35] available that I can use on phone.
[00:37:36] Thomas: I can just quickly talk to it. Right. And I think that’s, [00:37:40] that’s super valuable because very often when I listen to podcasts, I’m like, all right, that’s really great. And [00:37:45] then, you know, I consume other pieces of data and it goes kind of to the background where this, you know, Now there’s [00:37:50] a follow up and there’s something that i’m actually learning and i’m actually storing because I like it [00:37:55]
[00:37:55] Liam: so what we’re what we’re working on and the final version may look slightly [00:38:00] different, but um, Hopefully what we’re going to be having is on the back end of the [00:38:05] website It’ll be a passwordless login into the subscriber part of the website You’ll jump in and [00:38:10] you’ll basically have the video on one side, the transcript of the podcast episode on the other [00:38:15] side, it will go, um, as it’s playing through the podcast, you build a read along with the podcast, [00:38:20] and then at any point that you want to basically talk to the podcast, you can pop open [00:38:25] the, What The Three GPT and ask it a question.
[00:38:27] Liam: And it will be as if you’re asking. [00:38:30] Us essentially and the guests and every other guest that’s been on there [00:38:35] and all of our research that we’ve done That we’ve trained and put into the rag model like as you’re [00:38:40] watching it live Like there is no more interactive way of having a podcast like this [00:38:45] Um, and i’m super excited about it It’s something that we all came up with together in terms of like what?[00:38:50]
[00:38:50] Liam: Would be the best value for the audience and how can we utilize emerging [00:38:55] tech in this tech podcast? And the even crazier thing is it’s not even that hard to build. I [00:39:00] will give you that secret in terms of like, this is one of the secrets of like, like to build [00:39:05] stuff with AI. Like it’s so modular. I say it’s not that hard to build.
[00:39:08] Liam: I probably like 80 percent of the people [00:39:10] in the world, but I have no idea how to build it. But for me, like for the people listening, that’s what I’m saying. It’s not that hard to [00:39:15] build. If you’re a tech founder and emerging tech founder, or, you know, the guy to hire or the girl to hire. [00:39:20] To do this stuff. It is very doable.
[00:39:22] Liam: It’s not like you’re gonna need months to build [00:39:25] this with a 30 person team. You better hire Adev to do [00:39:30] it.
[00:39:30] Charlie: Fully agree. Right. So I’m gonna step in here away so we can meander [00:39:35] away from the AI tool, which is gonna be awesome. No,
[00:39:38] Liam: all we talk about is [00:39:40] GPT what? The 3G PT. Sorry.
[00:39:41] Thomas: More shilling. I want more shill, so, [00:39:45]
[00:39:45] Liam: right.
[00:39:45] Liam: Um, should we, should we jump onto what the, uh. What the mission statement is [00:39:50] essentially because I’ve prepared a little something something charlie if you want me to It was [00:39:55]
[00:39:56] Charlie: mission and then I was going to go through the episode structures people know and again [00:40:00] You do that
[00:40:00] Liam: you do the episode structure.
[00:40:01] Liam: I’m gonna i’m gonna say in a world [00:40:05] In a world where technology evolves faster than we can keep up, and it’s crucial [00:40:10] for founders to stay ahead of the curve, whether it’s the transformative potential of Web3, [00:40:15] the omnipresence, artificial intelligence, or the intricacies of blockchain, we’ve got [00:40:20] you covered.
[00:40:22] Liam: What The Three is more than a podcast. It’s a [00:40:25] mission, a mission to empower you, the backbone and future of technology with the [00:40:30] knowledge and insights and wisdom from those who’ve navigated, navigated these waters before from [00:40:35] reputable startup leaders to seasoned professionals, we’re bringing the experts to [00:40:40] your ears.
[00:40:40] Liam: Our inaugural season is packed with everything you need to lay the [00:40:45] foundation for your venture. We’re talking venture capital insights, legal insights, go [00:40:50] to market strategies, and so much more. Each episode is a piece of the puzzle, helping you [00:40:55] to see the big picture of what it means to run an emerging tech business.
[00:40:59] Liam: But it’s [00:41:00] not just about the hot skills. It’s about the mindset, the strategies and the failures [00:41:05] and the victories. It’s about understanding that the heart of technology, it’s about people [00:41:10] who make a difference. That’s why we’re here to connect you with the stories and [00:41:15] strategies and the people behind the tech.
[00:41:17] Liam: So whether you’re in the [00:41:20] trenches of building your startup or you’re dreaming of launching the next big thing, What The [00:41:25] Three is your guide through the ever changing landscape of emerging technology. So join us [00:41:30] on the adventure as we explore the next stage of the internet, dive into the minds of [00:41:35] startup founders, unravel the complexities of venture capital, and so much more together, [00:41:40] we’ll uncover the secrets to success in the tech ecosystem, one episode at a [00:41:45] time.
[00:41:45] Liam: So buckle up. And dive into the world of emerging tech with our very first [00:41:50] episode, what is Web3, the next stage of the internet. It’s time to explore [00:41:55] the infrastructure and tools that would define the future of tech startups. I [00:42:00] should have said that earlier.
[00:42:02] Thomas: Why, why do I feel that we need like the [00:42:05] more, you know, kind of a thing rolling in right now, like, you know, you know, that thing, right?
[00:42:09] Thomas: It’s like [00:42:10] the more, you know, Uh, or Skeletor, or Fallout. [00:42:15] Yeah. One man.
[00:42:17] Charlie: Yeah.
[00:42:18] Liam: Exactly. One [00:42:20] opportunity. This is the key, for me this is the key that I want to put in like, We’re going to try and have some fun with it. [00:42:25] It’s going to be professional. It’s going to be to the point, but everything we said on that, I just said that we’re going to be [00:42:30] delivering.
[00:42:30] Liam: Um, and it’s not going to be dry. The, [00:42:35] What The Three after the dark is going to be very not dry. Like we’re going to have a lot [00:42:40] of fun with that. Um, but this is gonna be very structured. And I think that’s something that Charlie wants to talk to you next, [00:42:45] that this isn’t also just a sporadic [00:42:50] random kind of collection of thoughts.
[00:42:52] Liam: This is. What is it like six, [00:42:55] six to nine months worth of work going into this, this project in terms of [00:43:00] what we’ve prepped for it. So there’s been a lot of thought, a lot of strategy, a lot of [00:43:05] pivoting left and right around specific concepts till we’ve figured out what we’ve, we’re very [00:43:10] sure. Is. The perfect formula for [00:43:15] how we would want to ingest this content.
[00:43:16] Liam: Because say with where you guys, where the listeners in a lot [00:43:20] of this, um, but also allowing for the guests to tell us that we’re all wrong, that’s all fine. [00:43:25] Um, cause we’re all learning together. So Charlie, do you want to run us through the structure? Let’s say this is, this is a [00:43:30] series season. This has a beginning.
[00:43:31] Liam: It has a middle and it has an end. This isn’t like [00:43:35] each week’s a different guest for a random reason. Is it?
[00:43:38] Charlie: No. So, I mean, we went back [00:43:40] and forth on this quite a bit. The idea being that, [00:43:45] so we’re, we’re looking at 12 to 14 episode run. Our goal was to. [00:43:50] Give people the kind of starter pack of what you should be [00:43:55] thinking about and what you should do when you’re starting a [00:44:00] emerging tech startup Um, the first episode is us.
[00:44:03] Charlie: Welcome to the episode. [00:44:05] The second Is the mindset of the startup founder originally was going to [00:44:10] be how do you run a startup business? But it just became [00:44:15] painfully obvious that this was really all about mindsets We’ve again an example of the [00:44:20] pivot that we’ve had to make Um, third Venture Capital Insights.
[00:44:23] Charlie: So [00:44:25] it’s in, in essence. So why, [00:44:30] like, so much of the burden of figuring stuff out is on the startup founder. We are [00:44:35] literally just gonna go to people who know the market inside and out and ask them, what is [00:44:40] it you are looking to invest in? Mm-Hmm, . And how do you see that? Like, what is it you’re looking for?[00:44:45]
[00:44:45] Charlie: Why do you look at that, that way? Which in, like, my [00:44:50] hope is that that episode will be able to give you the insight to be able to look in the right place [00:44:55] and then position yourself correctly to be able to say, okay, I’ve answered these questions [00:45:00] that the people who give money to these businesses are looking for.[00:45:05]
[00:45:05] Liam: I think, just to quickly jump in. I think what it also allows people to do, and this will be [00:45:10] really fun. So have a think about this and bring a notepad or your laptop with you when you watch the first episode is [00:45:15] almost the idea of build along as well. Like you could, if you, if you don’t have an [00:45:20] idea, but you want to be an emerging tech founder and you’re not listening to the first episode, as Charlie said, that will [00:45:25] give you the ideas of what people are investing in.
[00:45:27] Liam: You can then go away, do some thought [00:45:30] thinking speak to What The Three GPT, and then come up with some ideas for startup. [00:45:35] And then the next week, It goes on. And do you want to explain how that process, cause it is [00:45:40] like very much that, isn’t
[00:45:42] Charlie: it? It’s literally step by step. So, [00:45:45] um, let’s say you’ve, you’ve got your mindset locked in.
[00:45:48] Charlie: You’ve listened to us ramble and have a good [00:45:50] time. And then you’ve spoken to VCs and got a general [00:45:55] idea. Also that access, right? So how, when could you [00:46:00] get. An hour, an hour long meeting with a managing partner of a prolific VC in the [00:46:05] Web3 space difficult, right? Um episode four is [00:46:10] then Speaking to someone who has been on that journey and done it [00:46:15] successfully time and time again Looking at the market landscape, which is the next thing you should do and [00:46:20] finding the opportunities So when you’re looking at the market, [00:46:25] right?
[00:46:25] Charlie: What, what are the VCs looking for? What should I be looking for? [00:46:30] What are the patterns that I should be looking for? Why is this [00:46:35] idea even remotely good? And how do you de quantify that? Fifth episode, [00:46:40] again, partner of a law firm. So it’s legal insights. So [00:46:45] is what I’m trying to do even legal? Was the fifth thing or fourth [00:46:50] originally, but fifth thing now.
[00:46:51] Charlie: That we thought was probably a good question to ask up front. [00:46:55] Um, moving on to go to market strategies. And this is one where I think it’s [00:47:00] just so fundamental in that people get wrong all the time. [00:47:05] You’re a lot of people I see they, they go out, they have an idea, they You know, ask their [00:47:10] family. They think it’s a good idea and then they spend six months trying to build it.
[00:47:13] Charlie: I’ve made that mistake too. [00:47:15] The one thing to do Is and this is like you learn this you either learn [00:47:20] this lesson or you just get burned by it over and over again Figure out whether figure out [00:47:25] whether people want it first whether there’s an opportunity in the market Figure out whether the signals are good figure [00:47:30] out whether it’s legal and then try and pre sell it Right.
[00:47:34] Charlie: Go to market [00:47:35] with the product already and see if anyone’s willing to give you any money for it. [00:47:40] Actual money. So that was go to market strategies is next validate your [00:47:45] product. Number one, devising effective go to market strategies. And once you found a day to that, how can [00:47:50] I scale the way I validated it?
[00:47:52] Charlie: Very simple. Uh, and then seven is [00:47:55] valuation.
[00:47:55] Liam: I say quick answer there is go to Solana and do a pre sale meme coin. [00:48:00] Because that’s all the rage at the moment. You just people just ape [00:48:05] solana at you. So there you go Problem solved [00:48:10]
[00:48:10] Thomas: Come on, Thomas. Oh, I said problem solved problem You don’t need to listen to [00:48:15] that episode if you’re going to go on solana And if you’re
[00:48:18] Liam: emerging tech is some sort of [00:48:20] dog inu cat frog coin Then yeah, skip that one.
[00:48:24] Liam: Pre sale [00:48:25] Solana done the work for you.
[00:48:28] Charlie: Um, episode seven [00:48:30] moving on is then valuation. So I’ve pre sold it. Got some traction. Market [00:48:35] likes it. Legals are there. What’s this thing worth? Like, I think one [00:48:40] of the things that people really have to ask themselves is, is this worth my time? Is this what I want to do?
[00:48:44] Charlie: [00:48:45] Um, eight is then looking at the finances. Like how do I optimize my [00:48:50] capital expenditure? Roughly how much they give to what part of what function? [00:48:55] Um, nine is potentially strategy and operations if we [00:49:00] get the guests in. So, right, I’ve got my finance, I’ve got everything else lined up. [00:49:05] What do I then do?
[00:49:06] Charlie: What’s the first thing I should be doing? What’s the next thing I should be [00:49:10] doing? How should I operationalize that? How should I run that? So it’s not [00:49:15] me jumping from task to task for 9 to 10 hours a day struggling [00:49:20] to keep plates spinning. Um, 10 is then once you’ve got the start [00:49:25] off, it’s then what do you have to consider when you’re running that business?
[00:49:29] Charlie: Like, [00:49:30] where are you looking for the edge in running that business? [00:49:35] 11, tech building and innovation from a prolific [00:49:40] builder. 12, it’s growth strategies. So once you’ve got [00:49:45] this mechanism, you’ve built this engine, how do you put more gas in the tank? [00:49:50] Uh, 13, sales conversations. So how are we [00:49:55] selling this machine that we’ve built?
[00:49:57] Charlie: And 14 is what you’re [00:50:00] building towards, brand. How do you [00:50:05] essentially build that goodwill? It’s like everyone, everyone can go to the Far East and buy [00:50:10] some sneakers for 50 quid, 20 quid, 10 quid. Why are Nike’s [00:50:15] 150 brand? Like how are you going to start your brand? How are you building your brand? [00:50:20] What is it about your brand that’s important?
[00:50:21] Charlie: 15 bumper episodes, [00:50:25] UI, UX. What is it as a base level design? And this [00:50:30] is, I mean, this is one of those questions that I’ve had. Uh, a hundred times, which is what’s the [00:50:35] optimal outline for a landing page. How do [00:50:40] I get people to convert? How do I get people to like sign up and, you know, click on my link and talk to me.[00:50:45]
[00:50:45] Charlie: So that’s, that’s the 12 to 14 with the bonus. If you make it all the way through, that’ll become [00:50:50] released to you. But that’s the structure of the episodes.
[00:50:54] Liam: And then, [00:50:55] so for each episode, we’re going to be bringing on a. Um, [00:51:00] an expert in that vertical, and we’ve got a very specific [00:51:05] structure for how the episode is run.
[00:51:08] Liam: Um, do you want to run through that just [00:51:10] very briefly, Thomas or Charlie, whoever’s feels more comfortable doing it.
[00:51:14] Thomas: We start with an [00:51:15] introduction segment just to dig into who the guest really is. Some anecdotes on. What they’ve [00:51:20] done in their generally long and fruitful career. And [00:51:25] also, you know, some stories around fun stories, sad stories, scary stories, crazy [00:51:30] stories, right?
[00:51:30] Thomas: Like we’re emerging tech that they’ve been in. Some have been in a. com bubble or [00:51:35] even before that. And Dick did tech before that. They’re, they’re amazing stories just to [00:51:40] listen to. But in each of these stories, there’s also, I think, some lessons or [00:51:45] some perspectives for new entrepreneurs or, or Syrian entrepreneurs.
[00:51:49] Thomas: Um, and then we [00:51:50] make our way to the tips. Like we always ask our guests, like, [00:51:55] Hey, what, what would you recommend to like first time founders or Syrian [00:52:00] entrepreneurs that are coming in the, in the emerging tech space? What, what, what are the [00:52:05] 10 most important things you will give after that? We love [00:52:10] to just have a brainstorm with like three, two or three segments, depending on, on the time [00:52:15] that we have left, but there are always industry specific, uh, an expert [00:52:20] specific brainstorms where what we found or what we will find is [00:52:25] a lot of knowledge rolls out and a lot of perspectives roll out.
[00:52:28] Thomas: We think otherwise [00:52:30] won’t roll out. It’s just an interview, right? Because what we really want to do is having a [00:52:35] conversation with our guests rather than just, [00:52:40] you know, asking questions, getting answers and move on.
[00:52:43] Liam: And last, just to jump in, [00:52:45] that’s one of the sections that hopefully going forward, we’ll be able to get, Um, [00:52:50] audience and listener kind of more participation in because what those brainstorms are is basically here’s [00:52:55] some scenarios.
[00:52:55] Liam: How do you deal with this? Uh, and actually like trying to find [00:53:00] solutions. So rather than just like, what would you do in this scenario? And being very generic kind of question they’ve been asked [00:53:05] a million times, like trying to play out some very specific things that own, [00:53:10] like that we need that sort of expertise from.
[00:53:12] Liam: So that’ll be where we’ll be asking the community, like, if you’ve got any [00:53:15] really specific kind of, um, scaling problems or legal problems, like [00:53:20] send, send us over the information, like get, get in touch and [00:53:25] maybe we can figure out and create a bit of a brainstorming session. We can basically try and like problem solve your problem [00:53:30] with one of these experts for you.
[00:53:32] Liam: Absolutely.
[00:53:33] Thomas: And I think to that point, I mean, if, [00:53:35] if there’s a lot of comments and questions, like I’m pretty sure that some of these [00:53:40] guests would love to come on to the after dark show. Um, so we can have that discussion [00:53:45] live, uh, if there, there’s a, there are large questions. Uh, we have great guests [00:53:50] that are really down to earth and love to talk.
[00:53:52] Thomas: That’s at least what we found. And, and [00:53:55] then the last and final segment, which I always find really cool. And so far I, I [00:54:00] had a lot of, uh, is, uh, we call it Desert Island Essentials. Right. So what are you [00:54:05] taking to a desert island? Um, and like, what are your essentials when you go to a [00:54:10] desert island or when you get dropped onto it?
[00:54:13] Thomas: And again, this, this [00:54:15] really goes back to, okay, you have a 20, 25 year career [00:54:20] in product design, UI, in legal. What are the five things [00:54:25] you would take if you’re 20 again, or you’re starting a startup with nothing? What are the five [00:54:30] essential things?
[00:54:30] Liam: That’s the thing. It’s a very special desert island. It’s a desert island that sends you back in [00:54:35] time 30 years when you land
[00:54:39] Charlie: to start again.
[00:54:39] Charlie: [00:54:40] No bags, no bags, like no money. You’ve got no investor. So you’ve got no bags, no [00:54:45] connections, no investor connections, nothing. No phone. Although
[00:54:48] Thomas: I believe that one of our guests said, [00:54:50] I want to take a Kindle. So, you know, we, we, we agreed on that one. [00:54:55] The beauty of it is that every time we ask these questions, there’s new, again, [00:55:00] new perspectives rolling out.
[00:55:01] Thomas: Like, I found, like, sometimes it’s books, sometimes it’s a mindset, [00:55:05] sometimes It’s a health advice. Be healthy as an entrepreneur. Like, [00:55:10] you know, you just sometimes do the 60 or say of 70, you’re crazy hours. Um, [00:55:15] be healthy. Your body is able to, to deal with it a lot easier. There’s, there’s a lot of different [00:55:20] things rolling out and we, we have.
[00:55:22] Thomas: Like 12 to 14 episodes that’s that [00:55:25] comes out to 60 to 80 pieces of essential advices that. [00:55:30] We believe will add value to to listeners and to the people that are actually [00:55:35] building right and are first and founders, but now or once actually centralized [00:55:40] into, let’s say, per episode five and then per [00:55:45] season 60, uh, essential [00:55:50] advice and perspectives take on your journey to be successful, [00:55:55]
[00:55:55] Liam: which What The Three GPT will all have the information on.[00:56:00]
[00:56:00] Thomas: I, I, I gotta admit like that. We definitely too, like, [00:56:05]
[00:56:05] Liam: I’m going to need, I’ve got a stream deck. I’ve just realized I’m going to have to set [00:56:10] up my stream deck for a couple of little sound effects, and I’m going to have to make a, what? The three GPT [00:56:15] sound effect. That can be played every time it’s mentioned.
[00:56:19] Liam: Just like an [00:56:20] NLP, like for logs. Yes. One, two, three. One, two, three. One,
[00:56:24] Thomas: [00:56:25] two,
[00:56:25] Liam: three, GPT. GPT. Oh, good. We have sound [00:56:30] effects. Amazing. So that’s the structure. And as I said, like we’ve spent [00:56:35] months going through this and finalizing and arguing backwards and forwards and [00:56:40] debating and moving episodes around. Like.
[00:56:44] Liam: It’s, [00:56:45] it’s been a very much a labor of love and we’re really excited for people to now [00:56:50] listen in, join us on this journey. We want to make it as collaborative as [00:56:55] possible. Um, because emerging tech space is something that’s really close to a [00:57:00] lot of our hearts. And I think the, so going back to the title of this [00:57:05] podcast, just like what is Web3?
[00:57:08] Liam: The reason why [00:57:10] I pitched that as the title, Was thinking about the [00:57:15] concept of Web3. So, and I’d love to just get your guys take on this as well before we [00:57:20] finally wrap up is web. When people say Web3, what they mean [00:57:25] is it’s the next version after web two or web two was interactive and social [00:57:30] media, um, websites where one was just the worldwide web.
[00:57:34] Liam: Everything was pretty [00:57:35] much static, static, apart from maybe some marquee text in HTML. It was all [00:57:40] tables and frames. We then got dynamic and we got mobile with web two [00:57:45] Web3 is the next evolution and I think it was Gavin would actually coined it as being for blockchain [00:57:50] with Web3 and he basically he took hold of it and said, Okay, well, blockchain [00:57:55] is now Web3.
[00:57:56] Liam: So aetherium Solana Cardano. All of these things are [00:58:00] web3. I do not believe that bitcoin is part of web3 and we can talk about that [00:58:05] in probably an after dark episode. My view on the difference between bitcoin, is [00:58:10] definitely something we can debate about. But web3 was taken up by blockchain. [00:58:15] But we’re getting some adoption in blockchain online and [00:58:20] logging in with wallets and stuff.
[00:58:21] Liam: But I would say we’re getting less adoption than [00:58:25] we are for AI and AI is changing the way the internet moves [00:58:30] Very very quickly. Um, whether you’re thinking about it from the point of view of the [00:58:35] contents of like like trash heap To a degree, like, I [00:58:40] don’t know if you’ve seen any of these posts on Reddit, but the amount of like now research papers that have just been written by [00:58:45] GPT that you just search for, I’m sorry, as an AI in Google Scholar.
[00:58:49] Liam: And it comes [00:58:50] up with lists of stuff. You’ve got images, you go on YouTube shorts. Now, half of them are just [00:58:55] AI generated garbage. There’s AI, and then there’s really bad generative [00:59:00] AI, but all of these things, but regardless of whether you like it or not, AI has been integrated into every part of [00:59:05] the internet.
[00:59:05] Liam: I think it’s actually a very good case to say that. Tokenization of the [00:59:10] internet which essentially is what blockchain and web 3 is kind of thought of now [00:59:15] More like will be more likely web 4 and be something to be built on top of a new [00:59:20] ai layer And the web 3 should maybe actually be reserved for ai Like so these [00:59:25] are but there’s no right or wrong answer here.
[00:59:27] Liam: It’s it’s a kind of an open ended [00:59:30] question Um, I know what do you think charlie being involved
[00:59:33] Charlie: from what I was involved in [00:59:35] 2017 2018? I think web 3 failed You I don’t think it existed. [00:59:40]
[00:59:40] Thomas: It existed at that point, right? Like it was Well,
[00:59:42] Charlie: there’s been ICOs and things like that were coming up.
[00:59:44] Thomas: [00:59:45] Yeah, was the Web3 term then already there?
[00:59:47] Thomas: I think we were still like just in the blockchain [00:59:50] industry. At least that’s how I always perceived it as a builder, but
[00:59:53] Charlie: It evolved from there. [00:59:55] Yeah, um[01:00:00]
[01:00:00] Liam: Okay, let me read No, Charlie’s right. 2014 is Is when Gavin Wood first used the term [01:00:05] Web3, which is when he kind of popularized it.
[01:00:08] Charlie: Right, right. [01:00:10] So, uh, to rephrase then, when I was working in it and we were calling it Web3, [01:00:15] which was 2017, 2018. Yeah, you’re right. We were releasing [01:00:20] ICOs. Um, the whole concept, like the vision of the industry was [01:00:25] things were going to be decentralized identity, money.
[01:00:28] Charlie: Like the whole point of [01:00:30] it was that we were going to decentralize away control of the financial sector away from governments that [01:00:35] didn’t really care about us as individuals. We would regain, [01:00:40] um, gain agency [01:00:45] over our funds and how we were going to make that work. I think the reason why I say I think Web3 [01:00:50] failed is 70 something percent, 73 [01:00:55] ish percent of blockchain projects are on Amazon, Amazon [01:01:00] hosting services.
[01:01:02] Charlie: Really? The front ends are.[01:01:05]
[01:01:06] Thomas: Well, there are notes sometimes too.[01:01:10]
[01:01:12] Charlie: If Emerson were to turn off, the [01:01:15] decentralized dream would turn off with it regardless of the percentage. And [01:01:20] that is just fundamentally against what we were working on in [01:01:25] 2017, 2018. I agree with your, your perception on. [01:01:30] And I actually think AI is the more [01:01:35] usable, more interesting. It’s gathered more velocity than [01:01:40] I can make some money on crypto in the circles I run and it’s, it’s more [01:01:45] practical.
[01:01:46] Charlie: There’s still a lot of complexity around blockchain that. A lot of [01:01:50] people don’t understand, I barely understand that is a barrier to [01:01:55] entry. Whereas AI is kind of, I’m talking to, you know, the end user. [01:02:00] They can, they should like, okay, I get what this does. So I can conceptually understand it. [01:02:05] And, and I guess that’s my point of
[01:02:06] Liam: view.
[01:02:07] Liam: What about yours, Thomas? So, so Thomas, before [01:02:10] you, you give your answer, I want to say that I think you make a really good point there, which kind of backs up my [01:02:15] view of kind of AI is kind of needs to be [01:02:20] Blockchain needs to kind of leapfrog AI a little bit in terminology, but I don’t know whether we can reclaim the vernacular now.
[01:02:24] Liam: But the [01:02:25] reason why I say that is I’ve just done a Twitter space today with the guys from the internet computer, [01:02:30] ICP. And you also look at what are we doing now with their [01:02:35] virtualization and stuff. I think the, um, decentralized computing and [01:02:40] decentralized cloud is really starting to find its feet. But [01:02:45] it’s kind of, it’s now behind AI in that thing.
[01:02:48] Liam: So I think it does [01:02:50] really so fit of tokenization of things kind of needs to be Web 4, but I think we kind [01:02:55] of stuck with it now.
[01:02:55] Thomas: Yeah. I mean, when you talk about tokenization, like I remember we already [01:03:00] tokenized data back in the day when we worked at AWS, right? You need to buy tokens to [01:03:05] get data. Um, so there was some, some tokenization going on.
[01:03:09] Thomas: [01:03:10] Um, that, that’s always like, I, I, I dunno, an engineer told me that a while ago, like, shit, man, [01:03:15] that that’s,
[01:03:15] Liam: yeah. But it wasn’t tokenized on a decentralized blockchain. No, it
[01:03:18] Thomas: wasn’t. No. And [01:03:20] so like, I, maybe I have a couple spicy takes on, on both AI and, and blockchain because [01:03:25] like, I’m long enough in this space probably to be it degen and I love [01:03:30] it, but I’m also very skeptical, right?
[01:03:31] Thomas: Like I, I said earlier, like, I look at block, do you really need a [01:03:35] blockchain? 90 percent of the times we’ve asked that question to agencies of two [01:03:40] projects, they don’t. Right? Like, they want it because it’s cool, it’s hip, but they don’t really understand it. [01:03:45] And then secondly, sometimes you need blockchains, but you don’t need crypto.
[01:03:49] Thomas: Hyperledger [01:03:50] is a great, great, like, you know, great solution for a lot of issues. Uh, [01:03:55] enterprise issues that I think solve a lot of good things. [01:04:00] Um, so, for me, it’s like, and [01:04:05] then secondly, do you need decentralized blockchain? Like a lot of [01:04:10] solutions, like you need immutable, right? You need transparency. [01:04:15] Do you need decentralized?
[01:04:17] Thomas: I don’t know. Like, does your average SaaS [01:04:20] platform need decentralized data? Do they really want to give up that data? Because [01:04:25] that’s also, I always love that discussion around like decentralized social media. And don’t get me [01:04:30] wrong here. I really love that. The perspective of Web3 and being decentralized, [01:04:35] right?
[01:04:35] Thomas: Like just of, well, let’s say decentralization of your data. Practically, if you [01:04:40] look at what a Facebook does or what an X does, what, what, what is their, their biggest stack? It’s, it’s [01:04:45] data, right? Like, um, everybody’s like, yeah, yeah, but if we, if we get big enough, then you know, [01:04:50] Facebook has no choice then to use decentralized data.
[01:04:53] Thomas: I doubt it. Like we’re talking [01:04:55] about 2 billion and some change users like they’re not gonna switch because you [01:05:00] you’re talking about like your data. Nobody cares. And that’s the problem of what we’ve [01:05:05] seen in in in blockchain for a long time. We’re focusing very heavily on technology. [01:05:10] Everybody’s always like, Oh, I did this really cool thing.
[01:05:11] Thomas: And it’s powered by blockchain. [01:05:15] I always said does my mom care? No. Does my dad care? No. Does my sister care, who is 10 years [01:05:20] older than me? No. Yeah, but
[01:05:20] Liam: when, when Facebook collapses just like MySpace did and you lose all [01:05:25] of your data and access to everything, you’ll be wishing you were using Lens.
[01:05:29] Thomas: I [01:05:30] fully, I fully agree, uh, but the, the, I’d argue that [01:05:35] even if that, uh, Breaks down and collapse and I, I surely hope so, [01:05:40] uh, together with all the other big, uh, social media companies.
[01:05:43] Thomas: Not a lot of time for them, it will. [01:05:45] Oh no, it will, but it’s, like, it’s data. Everything fails eventually. People will keep, [01:05:50] like, there needs to be a move, but I think the movement of decentralization is a lot, takes a lot longer [01:05:55] time than what people think. Like, I [01:06:00] 5 to 10 years, I’m like, no, I think it’s close to 20 to 40, because it’s a really long, [01:06:05] like, You’re talking about data, that’s like oil.
[01:06:07] Thomas: It’s like, it’s asking Saudi Arabia, it’s like, oh yeah, we’re [01:06:10] switching to electric right now. Saudi Arabia will say, yeah, well, it’s great, but we’re still selling oil, we’re not gonna just buy it. [01:06:15] Throwing our oil away. Right? Like there’s a lot of resistance from big companies and there’s a lot of lobby behind it.
[01:06:19] Thomas: So [01:06:20] I’m very curious where this leads us. And, and Liam, to your point, like I [01:06:25] also look at Bitcoin and different, totally different discussion. [01:06:30]
[01:06:30] Charlie: Well, I mean, the interesting point you raised was you’re always switching to electric. [01:06:35] That means so dull. Where does the electricity come from? Oh,
[01:06:38] Thomas: look, Hey, I, I fully agree.
[01:06:39] Thomas: I [01:06:40] had that discussion many times. call mate. We take call [01:06:45] scroll scroll oil. No, like I, so. But what I, what I will say is, is this, [01:06:50] uh, regarding AI, like, we’ve been doing data science, ETL pipelines for the last 10 years. So it’s like, we did [01:06:55] AI before it was cool. Um, and, and it’s still, that’s still the uncool side of [01:07:00] AI, right?
[01:07:00] Thomas: Like, DEN AI is the cool shiny side, but that’s what all AI has [01:07:05] going for them. They were front runner. They have, they have, uh, DEN AI. How, how quick, Did [01:07:10] OpenAI get there, like, till 90 million? Like, was it five days or six days? Something like, it was an insane [01:07:15] amount of, of, uh, subscriptions or people signing up in, like, less than five [01:07:20] days.
[01:07:20] Thomas: What do we have in, in blockchain? We have an ETF. Which, by the way, works really well, but it says [01:07:25] something that, that our industry is more of an infrastructure, [01:07:30] potentially heavy finance industry, where AI is more, like, [01:07:35] it becomes more of a consumer product. And I think that is You
[01:07:38] Liam: say that, sorry, [01:07:40] but BlackRock just announced their 100 million seed investment of a [01:07:45] tokenized asset fund.
[01:07:46] Liam: So they’re tokenizing assets on blockchain on Ethereum as of like two [01:07:50] days ago. So it is also happening in the tokenization part.
[01:07:53] Thomas: It is. It is. [01:07:55] And I’m curious if that will actually accelerate things, right? Like, I really hope so. But, [01:08:00] um, you know, throwing money at something or getting natural adoption like [01:08:05] OpenAI did, which got a lot of money thrown at it, right?
[01:08:09] Thomas: I [01:08:10] mean, what was it? Like a historical amount of billions. Yeah. So [01:08:15] it’s, I fully agree with, with like, but money doesn’t solve everything. Uh, I have a [01:08:20] great last thing I will say about this. I used to work for a project, a [01:08:25] billion dollar, uh, unicorn project from a certain country that [01:08:30] always, um, throw money at the problem.
[01:08:33] Thomas: It’s kind of like that. Oh yeah. We’re, we’re having, [01:08:35] uh, uh, uh, you know, one, one mother, nine months for baby. Right now we’ll have nine [01:08:40] mother, nine mothers. And. Takes one month. Some things you can’t accelerate with money. [01:08:45] And it is really great that a BlackRock throws a hundred mil at tokenization. I’m [01:08:50] really bullish on that.
[01:08:52] Thomas: But still. Um, that [01:08:55] doesn’t like the fact that an open AI gets like what 90 million, [01:09:00] uh, signups in less than five days or in five, 10 days, I don’t remember the numbers [01:09:05] says something about the adoption that we don’t have while we’re doing this for a very long time. Right? Like [01:09:10] we’ve been pitching and pushing for mass adoption for such a long time.
[01:09:14] Thomas: I actually saw [01:09:15] that Starbucks NFT program died a couple of days ago, which was, in my opinion, also a shitty [01:09:20] program. It says something about bad implementation, right? And we’re really good in our, in our [01:09:25] industry to do bad implementation or to focus too much on technology. And that’s something that makes me a bit [01:09:30] sad because there’s a lot of good solutions out there and I’m sure you’ve both seen them and it’s just a [01:09:35] shame that they’re not being shown for what they really are.
[01:09:37] Thomas: And instead it’s as, Oh, [01:09:40] it’s a great blockchain solution. But he cares, right? Sorry. [01:09:45] I
[01:09:46] Liam: say, I think this is, we’re, we’re, we’re, we’re delving into what. [01:09:50] And we’re going to, I think we’ll stop this at this point, although I’m going to get the final say, um, [01:09:55] This is essentially What The Three after the dark because like this is the stuff [01:10:00] we’re going to go into We’re going to push back on each other much more than this um The one thing I [01:10:05] just wanted to leave it on was You also just said that you were building an ai before it was cool [01:10:10] Ai was being built and has been worked on for 20 30 years [01:10:15] So you’ve got to remember it that as well like you think oh, you know AI got adoption really [01:10:20] quickly.
[01:10:20] Liam: Generative AI got adoption. I was using Dali, not Dali, uh, [01:10:25] DaVinci in like 2019 or whatever, like, and there were other models before that. [01:10:30] So it had its unicorn app moment. We need something similar in [01:10:35] Web3. Yes, I would agree. Yes. But I think it’s wrong to suggest that they’re [01:10:40] like parallels, like open AI came out of nowhere with, with, This AI thing.
[01:10:43] Thomas: I mean, no, no. [01:10:45] Okay. I, I, I fully agree. And, and again, this is an after that, this after dark [01:10:50] discussion, a hundred percent, but I, I will say that, uh, what is it? They do have a front [01:10:55] runner,
[01:10:55] Charlie: right? And we, I’m sure I do. You folded your hands real quick there, Thomas. [01:11:00] I, I’m not sure I do agree with you.
[01:11:02] Thomas: Well, no, no.
[01:11:03] Thomas: I mean, like, no, I, I will, [01:11:05] yeah.
[01:11:05] Charlie: It’s the consumer side. No, but the blockchain is like, [01:11:10] Okay. We’re going
[01:11:10] Liam: full after dark though. No, of course, there’s been [01:11:15] AI versions of AI video editing AI. This, like what it was is actually way [01:11:20] less penetration. The blockchain’s got, I actually say the blockchain and organization has got massive amount of [01:11:25] penetration over its time.
[01:11:26] Liam: Look like Coinbase becomes every, every top of the bull market. [01:11:30] Coinbase becomes the number one finance app on downloads. The only AI app that [01:11:35] before check GPT was maybe a number one was probably some sort of. Face [01:11:40] fixing app for Instagram photos, so no, I call bullshit.
[01:11:44] Thomas: Well, well, I [01:11:45] mean, okay, so, so, and, and, like, I’m not sure if we’re, we’re comparing, like, the whole [01:11:50] AI industry or Gen AI with, with, with blockchain, right?
[01:11:53] Thomas: Because I
[01:11:53] Liam: think AI [01:11:55] industry. You can’t say, oh, Gen AI is a new thing now. Oh, okay. When we finally get
[01:11:59] Thomas: [01:12:00] a
[01:12:00] Liam: market fit in blockchain, I’ll say, this is not blockchain anymore. This is [01:12:05] Jen blockchain. And we’ve just got adoption in the first week and it’s the best, [01:12:10] right? I’m sorry. We’re going to carry this conversation on [01:12:15] from here in the very first, What The Three after the dark after dark, which will be [01:12:20] what is Web3.
[01:12:21] Liam: And the three of us are going to duke it out as to what it is. So you’ve got a little bit [01:12:25] taster of what’s going on. Uh, and the fact that I’ve stopped, I feel like I’m going to get. Like hit on two sides, [01:12:30] like the final view on it. Um, but ultimately what we [01:12:35] really need you to do is if you’ve enjoyed any of this episode, um, if you’re [01:12:40] watching on X, if you’re on one of the social media platforms that like subscribe, [01:12:45] whatever you’re able to do in terms of interacting with this content right now, that means you’ll see it [01:12:50] again.
[01:12:50] Liam: If you’re on X or whatever, and there’s a way to kind of click a bell button to get [01:12:55] notified, make sure you do that. So you see the next episode coming up, um, [01:13:00] and leave comments, ask us, tell us what you like. Tell us what you don’t like, like we’ve got, [01:13:05] we’ve just, we’ve got thick skin here. So if you think all of this is a pile of shit, Tell us and we’ll fight [01:13:10] you now.
[01:13:10] Liam: We won’t but we’ll engage And we’re looking forward to the very [01:13:15] first episode where we actually start bringing our guests in and you get to Like [01:13:20] hear from people that really know what they’re talking about And that’s what we’ve been trying to do is bring people [01:13:25] to you that will add value We want to build a community here.
[01:13:29] Liam: We know that’s not going to be [01:13:30] easy We’re willing to put in the effort and we know it’s going to be difficult. There’s a lot of podcasts out there There’s a [01:13:35] lot of choice You Charlie’s concept here was to build something that is [01:13:40] cornerstone content that can live forever. I’m going to put it on the blockchain.
[01:13:44] Liam: [01:13:45] Ha! I’m going to put it on the blockchain. I’m going to post all the episodes to [01:13:50] Lens, I’ve just decided. And people will find it whenever. [01:13:55] So, um, Thomas, Charlie, do you want to sign us off with anything else? I think I’ve said all I need to say [01:14:00] now.
[01:14:00] Thomas: Well, I, I think this all shows that, like, uh, we all have different takes [01:14:05] on this, and, and I think that’s also the value of when we talk to our guests and when we go through this whole season, [01:14:10] we all look different at, at different topics, and I think that’s [01:14:15] the value because we all come from different, uh, Hopefully that [01:14:20] value will roll out to the rest of our listeners and viewers
[01:14:24] Liam: for [01:14:25] sure.
[01:14:27] Charlie: Um, and I sign off. [01:14:30] Thank you for being here. You’ve got to this far in the video, ,
[01:14:34] Thomas: you’ll see [01:14:35] spicy takes .
[01:14:36] Liam: Yeah. Some spicy takes. Yeah. So everyone, we have been [01:14:40] what? The three and we will see you on our very first. This is like our session zero. Any of [01:14:45] your DD players out there trying to kind of get the lay of the land, we’ll see you with the official episode [01:14:50] one.
[01:14:50] Liam: Where we are talking with, who are we talking with Charlie?
[01:14:53] Charlie: Tim O’Brien on [01:14:55] Mindset.
[01:14:55] Thomas: And
[01:14:56] Charlie: that guy’s lived a life. I lived, he lived a life and a half. [01:15:00] We we’ve had a few careers. This guy’s tripled that
[01:15:03] Liam: for sure, for [01:15:05] sure. Well, we will see you on Mindset. Goodbye. See [01:15:10] [01:15:15] [01:15:20] you.
